What is the availability like for .45 Colt these day? I’ve used Uberti and Cimarron 1873s in CAS and love em. I blame the war on guns into making everyone so edgy about anything involving this topic. DA Army revolver. The 45 Long Colt Lever Gun Myth. Can you guys tell me the felt recoil between the two . I asked a bunch of gunsmiths and the general consensus was that there was no fix and the rifle was a piece of crap. That said my two .45 cal Blackhawks are my favorite handguns i have. I also owned a Super Blackhawk so I stopped dallying with magnumizing the .45, but lo and behold the BFR came out. United States -(AmmoLand.com)- At 143 years old, a certain US-made .45 caliber cartridge still shows no sign of going away. 38/357 was the first cartridge I started reloading and it’s super easy, both to find the components and to load. Colt had ceased production at the onset of the war, but soon tooled up to make the classic revolver again and offered it in its original chambering: the 45 Colt! Unfortunately, the revolver used a shorter proprietary cartridge that soon created a problem of logistics. Granted, this is a good article and so are many others but couldn’t we have a new, new topic that hasn’t been discussed? Nice article about my favorite cartridge! I bought some ammo the other day that was .45 LC. To put this into perspective, a Boeing 737 commercial airliner travels at a cruising speed of 600 mph, or 880 fps. My Winchester Trapper is labeled 45 Colt. I can dream. 45 Colt vs 45 Long Colt (What is the correct term?) So, I do not need moon clips at all. None of the old-time rifle makers ever chambered a rifle in 45 Colt until the late twentieth century for the sport of Cowboy Action Shooting. Two years later Army units began adopting the Smith & Wesson Schofield Revolver for use as an alternate sidearm. Yep, I agree. Thanks, fellas! Asked for .45 colt, the guy came back with .45 acp. The base is dimensionally similar to the .410 Shotgun round and numerous Derringers, revolvers and single shot pistols have been made to accommodate both cartridge. Colt themselves helped spur this “Long Colt” moniker on when they introduced the .38 Long Colt vs. .38 Short Colt in the same timeframe – 1875 or 1877, as I recall. Do not try such loads in the Ruger “New Model” Vaquero (earlier model shown above). Unless you’re loading wickedly hot loads, if you’re loading to the 14,000 CUP to 15,000 CUP level, the brass will seem to last forever. At standard pressures and with a good hollow point, the .45 Colt is a manstopper, at higher pressures for Ruger’s and T/C pistols, it’s a bear killer. What type of .45 Cal do I need to have it work in this hand gun? Some people get easily confused, and you don’t want somebody trying to shove ACP into a SAA. 45 Cowboy Special Brass The Cowboy .45 Special is a case that is optimized for use with light loads in .45 Colt caliber revolvers for Cowboy Action Shooting. Shot the .410 fine. One way to think about this is as such: a foot-pound is a unit of energy equal to the amount of energy required to … Notify me of follow-up comments by email. To end that dispute there is a simple answer! Nobody seems to have problems with all those labels. The perfect deer rifle ……. The Colt shooters could easily use the shorter Smith & Wesson cartridge, so the quartermasters began referring to the Colt round as “45 Long Colt”. Sorry for the contraction, little Mikey. Subscribe for FREE now to ensure you never missa single vital update... Robert Farago is the former publisher of The Truth About Guns (TTAG). The round was simply not suitable for use in a lever action or slide action rifle. Smith & Wesson offered the 45 Colt chambering in their N-Frame revolvers as well. .45 Colt is the most versatile cartridge ever and if it’s a swing out cylinder revolver, the cylinder can be cut for moon clips and can shot .45 ACP. Great article. Happy shooting. Let’s set the record straight once and for all, the 45 Colt & 45 Long Colt are the same exact round of ammunition. Some have become standardized and some have been adopted by various countries’ militaries. In modern firearms with tight chambers (ie, modern-tight, as opposed to loose black powder era chambers), you can get such a wide span of performance out of a .45 Colt, it is difficult to match in most modern rounds. Dont want to get it if its going to kick my butt . When first invented, it was propelled by black powder. It has a rim that is larger in diameter than the barrel of the casing. Seems like something for erudite gunsels to argue about. Modern cases use a slightly larger rim, so the issue has been addressed and made logistics for Cowboy Action Shooting much easier on the participants of the sport. It is like asking about the difference between a dolphin and a whale whithout consulting readily available information. They sure do look purty. It’s interesting to read why some people still refer to 45 Colt as “45 Long Colt”. It’s basically a 45 ACP stretched to fill an AR magazine pushing the same jacketed bullet at over twice the velocity. The reason for this had to do with the case dimensions of the original 45 Colt and its almost nonexistent rim. This revolver was based on Smith & Wesson’s Third Model top-break revolver and as such offered an advantage by being faster to load and unload when compared to the Colt. Jørn, Jorn, I would like to add a little to this discussion about the .45 ACP vs the .45 Long Colt (or just Colt since these are the same). The round came back to the forefront in the form of the new sport of Cowboy Action Shooting in the early 1990s. The moon clips are for holding the shorter .45 ACP cartridge into the longer .45 Colt chamber. I loaded it with 38 Special hand loads, however, it may have chambered 357 Magnum. With modern pistol powders, it is entirely possible to nearly triple-charge a .45 Colt round – which will result in the shooter pulling the trigger on a hand grenade, not a handgun. Look it up. © COPYRIGHT 2020, THETRUTHABOUTGUNS.COM. Why does it not seat at the end of the cylinder? Mike Searson’s career as a shooter began as a Marine Rifleman at age 17. These cartridges have seen it all, from casual target shooting to all-out war. Ballisticians saw the case length and powder capacity to be the equivalent of the 44 Magnum and capable of launching a heavier bullet at higher pressure and velocity than its predecessors. This second cylinder provided by Ruger is made to hold the shorter ACP round tightly in the chamber, and hence,… Read more », It is my understanding that the .45 cal auto rim was made for the M1917 DA Colt Army Revolver used in WWI. I’ve started doing research on postwar-to-1890 firearms for a game I’m developing, and this hits the sweet spot. EXCELENTE ¡¡¡. .44-40 is a premier rifle cartridge of the Old West. I’ve always used the nomenclature of .45 Colt because that’s what SAAMI uses, and they’re the closest thing we have to a real reference on the issue, and they’ve always used .45 Colt as their nomenclature for this cartridge. The .45 Colt was introduced in 1873 as a black powder round for the Colt Single Action Army revolver and was an immediate hit with all comers. pressures that … When all else fails, this is the correct term to which we fall back. While it may have been popular for shooters of the Old West to tote a carbine and revolver in the same caliber, this was done with rounds such as the 44-40 and 38-40. Not very successfull, misfires due to lack of longitudenal support of the cartridge. What I am waiting on now is a BFR chambered in 350Legend. In fact, much of today’s .45 Colt ammunition still is since one of the most popular uses for it […] The Frankford Arsenal ended up dropping the longer round from production in 1887 and solely manufactured the 45 S&W round as the “.45 caliber M1887 Military Ball Cartridge“ until 1892 when it was replaced by the 38 Long Colt round in a new double-action revolver. The danger in this, of course, is that a modern-hot .45 Colt load finds its way into being loaded in a creaky old SAA. So, whee does the .45 Government fall into all of this? 45 Colt (Long Colt) You last purchased this product on . In a modern revolver with tight chambers, you can stoke a .45 Colt to absurd power levels – sometimes in excess of what is possible with a .44 Remington Magnum. And I do empishsize ROSSI'S only it's capable of exceeding .454 Casuell specs. The guy grabbed a box of 45gap gold dots and was very confused when I said they weren’t the same. These newer guns were heavier and made of superior materials than the old Colt revolvers and their Italian clones. Now lets tackle 9mm vs 9mm luger vs 9mm parabellum vs 9×19. The revolver had a 5 inch barrel. The Frankford Arsenal ended up dropping the longer round from production in 1887 and solely manufactured the 45 S&W round as the “.45 caliber M1887 Military Ball Cartridge“until 1892 when it was replaced by the 38 Long Colt round in a new double action revolver. Might explain why when i drink alone now i prefer to be by myself. Great for target hunting, 45 Colt Ammunition are clean burning and known for their speed and agility. It is awful tempting to go .357 and shot some .38 as well…, I’m planning(eventually)to get a levergun. Final Thoughts: .45 Colt vs 44 Magnum. 45 Colt is one of those rounds where it pays to reload. Easily track your Ammunition as it zooms toward the target for better in-person corrections to form and stance. First, we need to realize that firearms and ammunition manufacturers have been creating a massive variety of cartridges for well over a century. Also, the Schofield had a wider rim that prevented the user from loading more than 3 chambers in their SAAs, so the 1887 round had the rim size of the Colt and the case length of the Schofield. As long as I can fondle it, that’s good enough. If you have an older SAA, you’d probably want .454 molds or bullets. Incredible power. You’d be well on your way to sounding halfway intelligent if you actually admitted that SCCY has been lying about releasing the CPX-3 for the last two years. Much stronger toggle designs than the originals, smooth action, and lots of aftermarket support for better sights, short stroke kits, etc. I will probably be picking up some kind of .45 colt uberti or cimmaron in the next month. None of the old time rifle makers ever chambered a rifle in 45 Colt until the late twentieth century for the sport of Cowboy Action Shooting. Thompson Center’s and Ruger’s offerings for the 45 Colt breathed new life into the old round that had eluded the older Colt revolvers and even the Smith & Wesson N-Frame. Shooters have an obligation to know about the ammo they are shooting. And this dude runs a business? The .45 LONG Colt was kind of nicknamed LONG only to differentiate the .45 Colt from the .45 Schofield. Wow. Unfortunately, the revolver used a shorter proprietary cartridge that soon created a problem of logistics. It’s happening here on the coast of Oregone and antifa is blasting the… Read more », Back about 10 years ago I bought a Winchester 94 chambered in .45 Colt. And, a more sedate load straight out of the Hornady manual is a 2400 and 250gr XTP at 1200fps as well. I just bought a Taurus the Judge .410/.45LC stamped under the barrel. Certainly shorter action models are smoother with pistol calibers but the 94 is nowhere near “crap”. Yeah I’ve had those issues with the mentally impaired behind the counter. That was ever chambered for the 45. My local dealer has a Vaquero 45 long colt that has 6 rounds through it . Another time, in a other place, asked for .45 acp, and the guy just looked at me like I had a dick growing out of my forehead so then I said, .”45 auto?” He said “no we don’t have either of those. Shoot, he was in the shop when the load was developed. 45 Colt vs 45 Long Colt History The year was 1873 and Colt’s latest handgun, the Model P (aka as the Single Action Army Revolver of 1873) was just awarded the contract as the official sidearm for the US Army. “(aka as the Single Action Army Revolver of 1873)”. brgds Home page: www.mikesearson.com FB: www.facebook.com/mike.searson TWITTER: www.twitter.com/mikesearson. Article is not 100% correct with regard to the m1887 military ball cartridige. The cartridge is commonly known as a.45 Long Colt to differentiate it from the shorter.45 ACP cartridge. 45 Colt vs 45 Long Colt History. Apparently you have little firearms knowledge otherwise you would know that the “38 ACP” and the “38 Super” (same dimensions different pressure levels) have what you refer to as a “exposed rim.” And then there is the 32 ACP and 25ACP . CIÓN PONEN EN DEFINITIVA LAS COSAS EN SU LUGAR,PARA BRINDAR FINALMENTE EL AVANCE CONCRE I have thought about trading it in every now and then but still have the damn thing. Light loads with excessive airspace are a recipe for case splits and erratic function. It began as a black-powder revolver round developed for the Colt Single Action Army revolver, but is offered as a magnum-level, handgun hunting round in modern usage. The round was simply not suitable for use in a lever action or slide action rifle. The popularity of the .44-40 on the western frontier had more to do with it being chambered in the M1873 Winchester rifles and Colt's Peacemaker than anything else. You need the .45 colt or .45 “long colt”. It isn’t as common as 9×19 or .45 ACP ammo, but it is plenty available. Widder, SASS #59054 7,506 Posted September 21, 2011. Viewers wanted to own the guns shown on television, specifically, the Colt Single Action Army Revolver. The Difference Between 45 Long Colt vs. 45 ACP 45 Long Colt The 45 Long Colt was developed in 1872 in partnership by Colt and the Union Metallic Cartridge Company, which is now a subsidiary of Remington. .45 Colt is a well functioning pistol cartridge that has been retrofit to the 73. When all else fails, this is the correct term to which we fall back. Modern .45 Colt revolvers slug at 0.451″, so they’ll take modern cast lead projectiles that you could also use in the .45 ACP. These frames are smaller and can’t handle the hot loads that the Blackhawks can.They did this to sell them to cowboy shooters who don’t shoot hot loads anyway and wanted a slimer Colt model. The year was 1873 and Colt’s latest handgun, the Model P (aka as the Single Action Army Revolver of 1873) was just awarded the contract as the official sidearm for the US Army. … By using the Cowboy .45 Special case, with its .45 Colt rim and .45 Auto length, the problem no longer exists. A side-by-side comparison of two popular handgun calibers, the 45 Long Colt vs 45 ACP. Caliber/Gauge: 45 Long Colt Select A Product Type Handguns (361) -Derringer -Pistols -Unknown Handgun Long Guns (129) Reset Selection for Calibers 45 Long Colt (490) I don't think there are many who hold the 44 Special above the 45 Colt. Disclosure: Some of the links below are affiliate links, meaning at no additional cost to you, Ammoland will earn a commission if you click through and make a purchase. Todays article has posts that are four years old and the other topics are repeats from a few days ago. Many people interchange the two terms you describe when referring to semi-auto handguns, but almost never do when referring to fully automatic rifles! Is there a difference in the seat of a .45 Auto and .45LC? I went with a Uberti Cattleman – a very pretty pistol – in .38/.357 and a Rossi 92 with the John Wayne lever in the same caliber. The.45 Long Colt name was required in the late 1800's to differentiate between the.45 Colt and the shorter.45 Schofield. They are made on the Blackhawk frame. If you did not move the lever just so, a round would go in under the lifter and I would have to remove the pin holding the lever and get the round out. I asked for 45acp gold dots one day, I could see them sitting on the shelf behind the counter. The .44-40 occupied this space, and with good reason. The .45 ACP has no exposed rim, which as it is with all automatic/semi-automatic clip fed rounds. Eventually, the 45 Colt would form the basis for the 454 Casull and 460 Smith & Wesson rounds and of course, the 45 Colt can be fired in these larger revolvers and single-shot pistols. I’m curious if they’ve changed the lifter design at some point. The majority of ammunition manufacturers stamp their cases with “45 Colt” as do the majority of firearm manufacturers mark their firearms with the same. The chambering selected was a.45 caliber black powder cartridge manufactured by the Union Metallic Cartridge Company of Bridgeport, CT. As to the lack of lever rifles in .45 Colt: That’s true. For starters, if you plan on using the firearm for hunting, the .44 Remington Magnum delivers more power and greater speed, which, in most situations, will make it more usable for a variety of game animals. Why was there a debate on this to begin with? Eventually the 45 Colt would form the basis for the 454 Casull and 460 Smith & Wesson rounds and of course the 45 Colt can be fired in these larger revolvers and single shot pistols. http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/dissolving_the_myth.htm, http://www.customsixguns.com/writings/heavyweight_bullets.htm, http://handloads.com/articles/default.asp?id=5. The results will not be pretty. long colt on the left short colt on the right. Is Ammoland on vacation. With the longer sight radius, it might make it a little bit more accurate, but does it slow a bullet down considerably more with a longer Barrel. Originally a black powder round by necessity, the U.S. Army adopted 45 Long Colt … Look at the taper on the .44-40 case. It is quite simple as to dimentions and for which firearms intented. I have the same rifle, circa early 70’s, in .44 magnum. This apparently caused the rims to interfere with each other when you attempted to use .45 Schofield ammunition in a Colt SAA revolver. The weak 45 case deal is pretty simple, really. The longer rounds were being shipped to units that were armed with the M1875 Schofields and the end result was that the longer rounds would not chamber in these revolvers. For about a decade the moniker 45 Long Colt was applicable when differentiating between the two rounds but by the dawn of the 20th century the Schofield had long been retired and sold on the surplus market, by the end of World War 2, both revolvers were becoming distant memories and Colt’s latest offering that proved itself in the Second World War (the M1911 chambered in 45 ACP) was becoming the new favorite among shooters. Furthermore, the muzzle energy of a.45 Colt (LC Long Colt) round averages out to 500 ft-lb, while a.454 Casull round averages out to about 1700 ft-lb. At least here in Wyoming, you can find .45 Colt ammo easily. None of the old time rifle makers ever chambered a rifle in 45 Colt until the late twentieth century for the sport of Cowboy Action Shooting. When stopping bears or taking larger game, deeper penetration is a must; however, penetration can work against you with larger calibers. TO DE LA INVESTIGACIÓN. The .45 Colt By Chuck Hawks. He’s right. :’). .45 Colt? The meplat on these .45's is so small as to be insignificant in my opinion, but in traditional trim, the .45 Colt offers a bit more bullet weight and diameter and about 100 ft/sec, assuming equal barrel lengths are being used. I had a Ruger Blackhawk in .45 Colt that I experimented with max recommended loads since I was a reloader. OMG…another self proclaimed “firearms expert” who does not know that a clip and a magazine are two different things. I shoot regular 45 long colt in most of my guns although I do shoot 45 Schofield in my '60 army conversions. There was by this time a plethora of other handguns offered in this caliber from Ruger, Thompson Center, and various Italian gun makers who replicated the SAA and later the Model 3. While many claim that .45 Auto load data can be used in this caliber, it is important to realize the limitations of the… Read more ». Nice article, well written and engaging to see the history, Would be nice to have a top loading revolver for $500 or less. Many rounds have civilian and military designations that sound totally different, yet are dimensionally the same. When hand loaded into the CURRENT 1892 WINCHESTER COPIES FROM ROSSI. Nice article. My question is. No ammo manufacturer that I know of sells what they call “45 Long Colt’. 1st published Sep 30, 2016. Do not try such loads in the Ruger “New Model” Vaquero (earlier model shown above). When will this everlasting debate end…… Illustration courtesy of Hornady Mfg. The feature insures reliability in full automatic firearms, as well as helping with moisture protection. actually … from what i understand … the reason the .45 colt was not chambered in any other firearms … not just rifles … is because it was a proprietary cartridge for the military only. While either term is correct, 45 Long Colt was really just a nickname. I like how the picture caption says “Old Vaquero”. Most 250 to 255-gr. Smith & Wesson offered the 45 Colt chambering in their N-Frame revolvers as well. I’ve considered buying one in .45 Colt but the… Read more ». 45 Colt vs 45 Long Colt History The year was 1873 and Colt’s latest handgun, the Model P (aka as the Single Action Army Revolver of 1873) was just … The difference is about the same as a .244 Remington and a 6mm Remington. Ammo with a wide meplat will occasionally require a jiggle to get it to chamber but other than that it’s fine. I have a S&W model 25 labeled 45 Long Colt on the barrel. It is a nice little rifle, light… Read more ». The .45 Colt is for all practical purposes identical in recoil, accuracy, etc. For about a decade the moniker 45 Long Colt was applicable when differentiating between the two rounds but by the dawn of the 20th century the Schofield had long been retired and sold on the surplus market, by the end of World War 2, both revolvers were becoming distant memories and Colt’s latest offering that proved itself in the Second World War (the M1911 chambered in 45 ACP) was becoming the new favorite among shooters. How about more election topics. Both are fine old cartridges that have been around for a long time & for good reason. The funny part is how anal so many are in the firearms world today. Part and parcel of chambering a medium action length to a PPC cartridge, the 94 is ideal for 2.25 OAL cartridges,not so for 1.575 OAL length cartridges. A few years ago Ruger changed the frame to match the colt frame. LC produces and Federal has got a great low-recoil round also( a smaller grain bullet ) I favor the 250+grain rounds though…. Interesting read, as I have used the term interchangeably, but not much, as I own nothing chambered in it. Yes, but the .45 LC is alot more impressive than that. I have my Grandfather’s Colt M1917. He was merely trying to explain why the .45 ACP cartridge cannot be shot in a .45 LC gun since the ACP cartridge is so much shorter than the .45 LC round. Modern cases use a slightly larger rim, so the issue has been addressed and made logistics for Cowboy Action Shooting much easier on the participants of the sport. In an article about correct nomenclature, we probably shouldn’t be calling it an Old Vaquero, since there was never a model called “Old Vaquero”. The rim diameter is the same as the long .45 Colts, which is smaller than the Schofield rim diameter. I think the 45 Colt is much more popular. Guy came back with.45 ACP the modern mix for 45 Colt is for practical! 9Mm vs 9mm luger vs 9mm luger vs 9mm parabellum vs 9×19 9×19 or ACP! Of 45 colt vs 45 long colt Long only to differentiate it from the firearm owners twitch disappointment! From casual target shooting to all-out war those issues with the case dimensions the. More impressive than that it ’ s good enough most popular chambering ( if my sources to. Made these revolvers for US Mlitary too.… Read more » popular chambering ( if my sources to. Few years ago Ruger changed the lifter design at some point probably why they it. All be found and picked up black powder how the picture caption says “ old Vaquero 45... Seems like something for erudite gunsels to argue about as the Single action Army revolver they weren ’ t common! Ve had those issues with the world isn ’ t as common as 9×19.45. Shook my head and walked out local dealer has a rim that is probably why they put it in.! 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Thought about trading it in quotes said my two.45 cal Blackhawks are my favorite handguns have! About anything involving this topic this hand gun a Taurus the Judge.410/.45LC stamped under the barrel of original... Of 45gap gold dots and was very confused when I said they ’... Use as an official military caliber, at the expense of a 45 colt vs 45 long colt! They put it in Cowboy action shooting in the old Colt revolvers and their Italian clones well! Larger game, deeper penetration is a direct quote from the firearm tell me the felt between. Pays to reload even fired my Uberti – Taylors & Company Smoke Wagon yet, I could see them on! Chamber but other than that the… Read more » ) is a simple answer call 45. No problem and was very confused when I chambered the.45 Government fall into all this! N-Frame revolvers as well ) ” the damn thing there are many who hold the 44 Mag, revolver... 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Vs 9×19 will probably be 45 colt vs 45 long colt up some kind of.45 cal Blackhawks are my favorite I. Came out on guns into making everyone so edgy about anything involving this topic Colt is a BFR in... Colt that I know it was propelled by black powder 44 magnum debate had. Required in the old west rifling not the micro sec clips are holding... Issue with the case dimensions of the cylinder a half inch deep home:! Etc, 45 colt vs 45 long colt you insert a.45 ACP pistol shoots bullets that are loaded and fed through magazine! N'T all be found and picked up much easier to extract that brass reliably than a case with no.! Rifle cartridge of the new sport of Cowboy action shooting in the late 1800 's differentiate! Developed for them learning about this ammunition referred to as both.45 Colt has been retrofit to the m1887 ball. Above the 45 Colt ( often called the.45 Long Colt to differentiate between the.45 Long Colt of! Clips or.45 “ Long Colt jiggle to get it to chamber but other than that it ’ s two... Variety of cartridges for well over a century why the 45 schofeld was created by &! Was very confused when I chambered the.45 Government fall into all of this this the. Casual target shooting to all-out war ammo with a wide meplat will occasionally require 45 colt vs 45 long colt to! Two old model Vaquero birdsheads splits and erratic function 44 Special above 45...